jshnyda
Member
Reged: 05/06/02
Posts: 174
Loc: Home of #14
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Hello,
I have been prescribed oxycodone 10/650,since June 2003 from my doctor. Every month I have to call the office for my refill because it is a schedule II medication and I have to have a hand written prescription. The pain is in my lower back, I have had MRI's and nothing has showed up. I am in pursuit of seeing a nuerologist, but it is difficult for one who will see me since my injury was due to a car accident. I am up for a refill on Feb. 6, that is 30 days since my last. He prescribes me 100 at a time to take every six hours as needed for pain. I am afraid after reading all the terrible withdrawel stories that he will cut me off eventually. I am wondering if he can do that or if he has to taper me off the medication. I did ask his assistant about four months ago about this drug and withdrawel if I stop taking it and she said," You shouldn't have any problems discontinuing use."!!!! After reading these terrible posts of withdrawels on this board I am scared to death!!! If anyone can give me advice I would appreciate it. I have been on this medication for 7 months now, taking it every day, dosage is 10/650 Endocet. THANKS!!!
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"treat others as you wish to be treated"
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johng
Board Addict
Reged: 02/13/03
Posts: 351
Loc: great lakes
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if he is a good doctor they will give you the lecture about how to taper and danger of addiction and give you one more month of med in order to taper. he his advie or seek another doctor. after the warning of (last refill) they wil not give any more. I have had succsus bay asking for a low type med hydrocodone. but it is malpractice to willing cut you off with out some taper sechd..
john
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Ask and it will be given to you Matthew 7:7
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voyager
Old Hand
Reged: 04/17/03
Posts: 413
Loc: United States Virgin Islands
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Just talk to him. Because he is decent enough to write a script for you to aid in the pain, I really don't think he would ever just cut you off.
Keep an open line of communication with him and just talk about your fears at your next visit.
I think that will help ease your mind a lot.
Good luck.
Voyager (david)
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jaydee
Stranger
Reged: 12/29/03
Posts: 18
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You will certainly have symptoms of withdrawal if you abruptly discontinue your medicine. No reasonable doctor would do this to you. A taper schedule of months, not days would be in order. You may want to consider a long acting medication if this is a chronic problem.
Good luck!
John
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Dasani
Enthusiast
Reged: 10/29/03
Posts: 286
Loc: FL
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I agree with all the above posts, but it only takes one call from the Board of Medicine and this guy could stop writing schedules scripts altogether. It happened to me! The pharmacy questioned the Dr.'s script writing and then reported it to the board. The board did a preliminary investigation and all of the sudden, my doctor, who was wonderful about writing the proper medication, became scared and said "I'm no longer writing scripts for scheduled meds". At first I thought this was just an isolated incident, but since then, I've heard the same story over and over again. My advice to you: HAVE A BACK-UP PLAN AVAILABLE JUST IN CASE SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAPPENS TO YOU! Unless you are Superman, you will w/d from the Oxycodone and it will be nasty. Don't get caught with your pants down and plan ahead.
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jshnyda
Member
Reged: 05/06/02
Posts: 174
Loc: Home of #14
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Thanks for the above posts and support. My Dad also goes to this doctor, he has rumatory arthertus (if i spelled it right) and has never had a problem. There are actually 2 doctors who write my scrpits, they are parnters. One handles coughs and colds, who is my doctor. The other handles pain management and more serious problems. Now that i think of it my Dad has gone to him for over 10 years and has never had a problem. I just found out that my G-ma, and Uncle also see these doctors. So I am not too worried anymore. I don't think he would ever cut me off, but I know I shouldn't stay on oxycodone for the rest of my life. I have planned ahead and have ordered hydrocodone(10/325) from an online OP, they work o.k. but they make me drowsey and feel doped up. I actually had myself down to one oxycodone a day(in the morning to get out of bed), and then 2 more hyrdo a day to replace the oxy. It worked O.K, I was a little cranky and had little energy but it worked. Then last week I fell on Ice off of a loading dock, and fell the same day right on my back. Two hard falls in one day, my back flared up so bad I had to go back to the Oxy.
I am only 29 years old and I feel like I am 50 with this constant back pain.
Anyway sorry to go on and on, but does anyone think using hydro to taper from oxy is a good idea?
Thanks to all who posted, I really appreciate it and anymore advice would be welcome.
I'm too young to feel this Best if kept off the board old!!!!!
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"treat others as you wish to be treated"
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SBELL
Newbie
Reged: 11/04/03
Posts: 35
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I agree with Dasanie. Have a back up. I was cut off,from hydro suddenly. Within no time I found an op. Saved me. take care
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ANNIEGIRL
Journeyman
Reged: 04/02/03
Posts: 60
Loc: New Jersey Best Beaches
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Does anyone know the conversion from oxycontin 20mg 2x a day to Lortab 10/325. What would be the equal. My doc says this is better since there is no tylenol in oxycontin. I am leary.I would take 6 10/500 a day to be pain free. Sometimes more!!! I need advice if I should stick to what I've been on for 3 years, or make the change!!! Thanks
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CrazyAnn
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Happy111
Newbie
Reged: 12/18/01
Posts: 26
Loc: New Jersey
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Wow! That is a long time and your blood test should show if there are any elevated liver enzyme problems. Try these links, one you enter some info the other is a chart. Hope this helps and yes, make the change but don't get caught up in the tolerance game.
http://www.globalrph.com/narcotic.cgi
http://www.globalrph.com/narcotic.htm
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lovepink
Goddess
Reged: 01/01/02
Posts: 1476
Loc: NYC Metro Area
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A former doctor of mine was certified in PM & speciaized in treating my type of pain - he is also a teaching professor at one of the most well known NYC Medical Schools & one would think he would understand the need for a gradual taper.
He put me on (at his suggestion, not my request) 90 mg. morphine with 180 10/325 percocets for breakthrough each month. After a few months he decided that I didn't "need" narcotics although they were working well & cut me off with just a week's supply of the percocet to get me through. He also wrote scripts for Neurontin & prednisone to replace the opiates, neither of which worked for me in the past. Unfortunately I broke down in his office, upset that meds that were FINALLY working for me were being taken away...my doctor saw my emotional state as "another sign of addiction".
ALWAYS have a back-up plan - this was done to me a couple of weeks before Christmas.
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Lovepink
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2muchpain
Enthusiast
Reged: 10/07/03
Posts: 274
Loc: USA
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Excellent advice, LP and Dasani. I was in a similar situation, which is how I found DB. An unplanned holiday was hellish and unnecessary. Now I have an 'in case of emergency break glass' kit.
Edited by 2muchpain (02/03/04 06:23 AM)
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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Of course the doctor can cut you at any time s/he feels it's "medically necessary." There is no physician's doctrine requiring medical doctors to taper anyone who has been on opiates for any length of time.
LP-I sympathize. I got demerol injections several times a week for 7 years and one day the doc decided to cut me off cold because I was "addicted." If not for the methadone program, I don't know what I would have done.
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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Emmee
Newbie
Reged: 10/09/03
Posts: 30
Loc: Northwest coast
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All of these stories are the reason there is a forum like DB. When it comes to pain management, the law, and the constant fear doctors are in (if not a lack of understanding of what pain can do to a person), anyone unfortunate enough to use the term chronic pain in describing themself has probably experienced a scenario such as any of these. I have even had the unpleasant experience of watching a terminally ill daughter of 19, Osteosarcoma, suffer in horrendous pain before her death March 7, 2003, because her doctors were concerned she might become addicted to medication. What infuriated me was they knew from the time she was diagnosed with one of the deadliest bone cancers there are, she was going to die a horrible death. My pain from her suffering and losing her is sometimes almost matched in passion from my anger at the doctors and their lack of common sense. I know there is a thing such as addiction. I also know when it comes to chronic pain people are desperate for a way to have days in this life that make it worthwhile to be here. If any doctors read these posts, I would ask them to think about the quality of their patient's lives. For the OP's I say thank you from the bottom of my heart for daring to do what many will not; treat patients with compassion and understanding. My daughter spent many of the last six months of her life, which is the amount of time from diagnosis to death, suffering horribly. What was her last Christmas and birthday would have been so much more memorable for us had she been medicated enough to have some degree of comfort. Now I am haunted by her pain and fear. I found DB as a result of that and other situations. I wish to God I had found DB sooner. I would give anything for the tools to have made her last days with us better.
P.S. She would have been 20 on January 26, 2004, and my heart is shattered.
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Emmee
Newbie
Reged: 10/09/03
Posts: 30
Loc: Northwest coast
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One last thing. In the beginning of her illness, I prayed God would not take her. I ached from the want of having her in this world. In the end because of her pain, I prayed God would take her away. It was the hardest prayer to speak. I knew her relief would mean she was gone. I know medication wouldn't have stopped her death, but we would have had months more of her, a springtime with her, if the doctors would have medicated her to a comfort zone. Fear of jail is a strong factor, so we all need to start joining together to change some laws. To storm legislation with our petitions. We have to take the power of treatment away from the politicians and place it with the doctors so they can freely treat patients without fear.
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snakey
Member
Reged: 05/20/03
Posts: 103
Loc: cally
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my prayers to you so sorry. There should be no utter of addiction towards people with cancer,even if you are fortunate to live 5 years after your diagnosis you should get all the meds you need,what is wrong with this world when the word addiction is used for cancer patients,who cares get addicted,get addicted. I always say whoever makes these laws should be in that position,and someone turn and say to them ta,ta you will be addicted,advil for you,that is how these lawmakers should be handled,WHY IN GODS NAME ARE THEY AFRAID OF SOMEONE BEING ADDICTED WHEN THEY ARE GOING TO DIE,DO THEY THINK YOU WILL TAKE YOUR ADDICTION WITH YOU,NO but maybe just maybe they will take their pain with them,not for long,just to teach them that people suffered needlessly because of their lousy laws,I am so pissed you don't know.We got my mother all the meds.she needed to make her last days great,we made a BIG stink,but boy we got em.I called them every name in the book,I said you people are Mental,don't dare use the addiction sh*t with me,I said she would be good and addicted no doubt,but she is not going to live long enough to ever have to worry about wds,the only thing she will be ADDICTED to is pain relief,they saw it my familys way,so six months pain free. These laws have got to change for cps and especially for cancer patients,I better stop I could go on. But I am deeply sorry for your loss,my prayers for you and your family,take care..snakey
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joesentme
Journeyman
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 91
Loc: USA
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D-
I am so sorry for you. I can't even imagine the pain you must be in.
I have a 20 year old daughter myself, and right now I am having a lot of problems with her, but that really put it all in perspective. At least I have her, for better or worse.
My prayers for you and your family. God be with you.
Jo
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catmom
Board Addict
Reged: 06/20/03
Posts: 319
Loc: Midwest
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I am so sorry, Dziekuje, to read of your loss! Your and your daughter's pain is obvious from what you've written. I have practiced as a nurse and was always a BIG pain control advocate for my patients. I know that your daughter is in better place. Take care  Catmom
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If it's not immediate, it's not gratification.
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Emmee
Newbie
Reged: 10/09/03
Posts: 30
Loc: Northwest coast
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Dear Jshnyda,
Selfish of me. I started my response with every intention of addressing you, and once again got off on my own tangent. My story is intended to say to you, if your current doctor starts giving you the old no more medication routine, find another. Demand that you be given treatment sufficient to maintain quality of life. Especially demand that whatever doctor treats you realizes that you can't go off these medications cold turkey. On every medication description you read, it states very plainly, do not stop taking this medication suddenly if you have been on for any length of time. It is dangerous to your health. You should tell you doctor that is setting you up for problems. You need a doctor that definitely understands the taper method of these medications. Good luck to you. As you can see, my feelings on the topic are strong for a reason. I wish I had started fighting the doctors from the start, but it's hard when you are in shock.
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jshnyda
Member
Reged: 05/06/02
Posts: 174
Loc: Home of #14
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D-
Thank you for the info. I feel like a tool. Compared to your daughter's terrible story my problems are very minor. I am very sorry for your loss. I know the feeling of loosing someone special and close.
June 21,2003 at 12:50 AM there was a car accident. The passengers were my girlfriend's two brothers(ages 17&20),another friend and myself. My girlfiend's youngest brother age 17 was the driver,because he WAS SOBER, not a drop af alcohol in his system. He lost control of the car and the drivers side was smashed by a telephone pole. I walked away with stitches,broken ribs and terrible back pain. Her brother age 20 and the other friend were injured with knee,shoulder,broken ribs and head injuries. Her youngest brother age 17 died on the way to the hospital. It was the worst night of my life. I was the only passenger who could move out of the car. I found Matt(age 17) laying 20 feet from the car as the ambulance arrived. I live every single day with guilt, anger and the terrible depression that my girlfriend and her family deal with.
They say everything happens for a reason. This one is a litlle hard to swallow. Everyone of us on this board were always taught to let the sober person drive. Well, we did and even though I still believe it was the right thing to do by letting him drive us, I am haunted with the "what if". What if I would have driven,what if anyone else was driving and Matt wasn't trying to impress the older guys by driving fast. I can't imagine how my girlfriend felt when she got the call that her two brothers, and boyfriend were just in a serious car accident less than one mile from her house. I can't imagine her parents pain and depression.
Sorry to get off the subject. But with D-'s story and my story, it puts things into perspective, thank God for everyday you are alive and live in good health. Live evryday as it is were your last. God bless you D and your daughter. God bless the little bother I never had.
I don't know why it is so easy to talk to strangers about my problems and I am sorry agian to get off the subject and bore everyone. Thanks to everyone for the input about handling my situation with my back pain. I feel this board is filled with good people and I am glad I found it.
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"treat others as you wish to be treated"
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Emmee
Newbie
Reged: 10/09/03
Posts: 30
Loc: Northwest coast
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Don't apologize for telling your story. The single most important thing for people that go through loss and hardship is to know they aren't alone. This past year for me has been hell. I know what you mean about being haunted. Though the reason for their death is different, illness vs. accident, the feelings of grief come out the same. The guilt with all other emotions. Most of all I understand your statement about that one line I hate hearing now, "Everything happens for a reason." I have faith, but it is hard to reason when someone young, pure, and with a bright future is taken. After my daughter's death people said all sorts of things to encourage me, but that one line was the most difficult to hear. As time goes by perhaps I can once again feel that, but now I don't. Deep inside I believe it to be true, because not to believe it somehow means her life and death was in vain. And I refuse to believe that. There is a purpose to it all because she was just that special. I am so sorry for your loss and the pain you suffer. I believe when we go through these traumas, sometimes speaking outside our circle of family and friends is the only way, because on the inside of that circle is too much pain. My entire family is grieving. Like an entire family that is depressed, but it isn't depression.
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jshnyda
Member
Reged: 05/06/02
Posts: 174
Loc: Home of #14
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Thanks D- for the post, I feel the same way.
But, getting back to my original post.....My doctor did what I thought he would do,he did not cut me off entirely, he lowered my dosage from oxycodone 10/650 three times a day to ONE tablet per day. I figured this would happen eventualy but it would have been nice for someone at the doctors office to tell me this!!
I called the office,told his assistant what I needed, he called back and told me my script was ready.
I get to the pharmacy and the pharmacist says," your total is $108.60!" .....I thought I was gonna fall over every other time it was like $15.00 for 100 10/650 oxycodone. I asked him to call the doctor's office and sure enough he cut me to one pill a day and my insurance will only pay for a 30 day supply. So, I got the 100 and paid out of my pocket!
To make a long story short....I now have a total of 118 oxycodone 10/650,I also have 50 hydrocodone 10/325.
PLEASE HELP IF YOU CAN......how should I go about doing this without going thru major withdrawel?
I asked the pharmacist,since my doctor didn't bother telling me, if I would have any side effects by cutting my dose. He said as long as I wasn't taking 4-6 pills a day I shouldn't withdrawel.......I guess I will find out.
AGAIN ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!
Thanks in advance,
Jeff
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"treat others as you wish to be treated"
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Trampy
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/02/02
Posts: 1217
Loc: Southwest U.S.
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your doctor didn't cut you off, he gave you 100 new pills!
many here have tapered with much less than you have. just write down a gradual decrease schedule and put it on your calendar. taper down with the oxy first and then switch to the hydro. when you're at 10 mg a day (divided dose) and stabilized for a few days you can just stop and suffer the minor discomfort or else go down to 5 mg/day if it's hard.
you'll be glad you paid the cash for those extra pills.
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Your mileage may vary ...
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NJ_Hoss
Enthusiast
Reged: 10/29/03
Posts: 263
Loc: USA
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Jeff, and to others in a similar circumstance, you may have had another option at the pharmacy.
Insurance companies do impose day supply coverage limits, and it is possible to ask the pharmacy to dispense only what is covered, and pick up the balance as a refill when the insurance company permits a refill (typically at 75% of the original fill's consumption). This may not coincide with tapering schedules, but it is a permissible way of obtaining full insurance coverage.
This cannot be done with Schedule II prescriptions, however. Nevertheless, again, if it would coincide with your tapering schedule, your prescriber could have written two prescriptions for you, or adjusted the dosage instructions (Sig) to provide a single prescription that would both coincide with your tapering schedule and comply with your coverage guidelines. It is entirely up to his discretion, and while physicians have a vested interest in writing one prescription as opposed to two, many will undertstand what you are trying to accomplish and help if he feels it is appropriate. It is entirely at his discretion, however.
I hope this helps. (If not in your particular case, someone who may encounter it in the future)
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