scissorhands
Member
Reged: 06/04/03
Posts: 168
Loc: Hell
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Since 14stones is a expert I thought I might shout-out for advice from him or anyone else that has had kidney stones.
I'm a female that works outdoors daily and drinking water is out of the question (hate the taste of it)and have reason to believe I'm suffering from a kidney stone(hope it is only one)...
What I need to know before making that much dreaded(hate drs)Drs Appt is what kind of symptoms do you have in the beginning and where is the pain localized at?
Please feel free to be honest, you won't scare me with the graphic details, except the penis issues, mainly because I don't have one...
Anyone else who has had kidney stones, I could use any advice right now, Thanks...
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Baseball is wrong...Man with four balls cannot walk!
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mslily
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Reged: 09/06/02
Posts: 322
Loc: Cincinnati, OH
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I have had 2 kidney stones (about 3 years apart) and I can honestly say that childbirth was a breaze comparatively (I have a 2 year old daughter). Let's see...For me, with the first one, I felt the constant need to urinate and was in the bathroom every 2 minutes, but unfortunately, not a drop. I have had bladder infections previously, so I assumed that was what it was since I had bladder pain and the frequent urination feeling that does not go away. I made the mistake of drinking TONS of water over a few hours trying to flush things through my system, but I just ended up throwing it up (sorry graphic). I do remember with both stones that I had a very sharp back pain, really near my shoulder blades on my right side (both were from my right kidney). Also, I had a fever and nausea associated with it...and the chills. I have polycystic kidney disease so I assumed that it was just pain associated with that possibly if it wasn't a bladder infection. I passed both stones on my own within 12 hours, but it is extremely painful. 14stones...you are my hero! I don't think I could go through another one. Good luck to you scissorhands...and go see your physician if your pain persists. It may be something else entirely...that is why we shouldn't self diagnose.
Candice
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scissorhands
Member
Reged: 06/04/03
Posts: 168
Loc: Hell
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Thanks Candice for the quick response and after having three sons I can relate to the childbirth issue. My first annoying symptom aside from the side back pain has been the constant urge to urinate but no luck. No fever but nausea most definitely and a lot of sweating.
I too have had numerous UTI's but this definitely is different as I have never had any pain with previous UTI's except for the urinating part. Thanks so much for your excellent advice and thanks Radgirl for the helpful PM message. 14 Stones is one tough cookie and that telescopic penis is looking at me right now, I can feel it...
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Baseball is wrong...Man with four balls cannot walk!
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14stones
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Reged: 06/18/03
Posts: 336
Loc: On the beach in California
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Hi and OUCH! I am sooo sorry that you are having pain that might be kidney stone related. I hate to say this but I actually believe that having a penis might make it easier to pass a stone as I have been told that the ureter opening is larger. (while I am a big fan of your equipment not having the same gear and having never examined one THAT closely I will take their word for it)
I will tell you what I experience and hope that if any of it applies to you that you will run to a doc or an E room to have it checked out.
I start feeling a pressure/pain in the tip of my penis. Then I feel a pressure pain on my inner thigh (the one where the stone is usually coming from) These are the warning signs that I might have anywhere from a few minutes to a half and hour before I go into complete hell pain. The nausea starts next and sometimes is allot and others just a little of the problem. Then the real hell pain starts. It is like having the worst back ache of your life but it is more of a feeling that someone has just kicked your genitals into your kidneys. I usually litterally end up on the floor on my side doing that "curly Shuffle" thing where you just spin around and around trying to auger yourself into the ground to get away from the pain. I find it difficult to talk but at the same time can't seem to stop saying how bad it hurts.
Those are the usual symptoms of a "bad" stone. I have passed smaller stones where I just get severe pain in my testicles and then the tip of my penis hurst really bad and I can actually feel the stone moving its way through my ureter.
I hope this helps and remember you can always pm me if you would like a more detailed description of what happens from beggining to end and what some of the things I do to make it so I can pass a stone at home are. I hope you are alright and I will keep an eye out for you.
Take care,
Ni
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Go that way really fast, if something gets in your way.....TURN! Always look on the bright side of life.
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quincy
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Reged: 11/07/02
Posts: 333
Loc: pacific northwest
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If you think you have a stone and want to know when to go to the doctor- don't worry-you will know!! I say this because the pain is so bad there is no question of going straight to the ER for some IV pain killers, which are really the only way of getting relief during a bad spat of renal colic. I suggest getting a diagnosis now, before the pain gets too bad. Since kidney stone pain is relativley easy to fake, many ERs will make you go through five hours of tests to make sure you actually have a stone before you get any narcotics. So you have to sit there in agony, alternatly screaming and holding your crotch. Childbirth feels nothing like a stone. Maybe the pain is on the same level, like a 12 out of 10 on the pain scale, but its totally different. Passing a stone feels to me like someone sticking you in the clitoris with a pin. Yes thats a nasty way of putting it, but thats what it feels like. It comes in waves, though, like contractions do. Imaging a sharp, stabbing pain that comes and goes in waves. That comes from the stone being pushed out the urethra by the bladder, which is a muscle after all. Right now I have a stone that is just sitting in my bladder. That means that I can (and do) have pain at any time. Last month the pain was so bad I had to go to the ER. They hooked me up to an IV, shot me some Dilaudid and sent me home. Normally the stone passes with pain like that but it didn't. It went away at the end of that day. I assumed I passed it and didn't see it, which can happen if you are under the influence of a powerful narcotic. But I guess not since just last week I had another attack. This time I didn't have any painkillers except for my methadone which I take for fibro pain and can only take so much of. I sat in a hot bath and tried to pass the stone there. Its just the worst feeling...I can't describe. Like having to pee really bad but you can't; all the while you have this stabbing pain down there. It feels like you can push this pain out, like you can with a baby, but it won't come. Kidney stones can be terribly frustrating this way. They have a mind of there own and like to strike at the most inopportune times.
I hope you won't sit there until the pain is so bad you can't walk. Go to your PCP and tell him what you think. Even if he tries to say its only a UTI, don't let him stop without testing you for a stone. Usually a CAT scan or X ray will diagnose a stone. Also, kidney stones are the one time that doctors aren't afraid to prescribe narcotics, so you will probably be able to get some percoset or something for this. As great as that works, I swear when that stone want to come, you will feel like you took Tylenol instead of Percoset. Don't worry though, go to the ER, get something stronger and push those fluids!! I promise the stone will pass.
Unless you have a really huge stone, or several. In that case you will probably need to have lithotripsy. I have had that operation and I would not like to go through that again. This may just be my experience, but I thought that the surgery was more painful overall than just staying home and passing it. Lithotripsy is when they put you in a big tub of warm water and blast ultrasound waves at your kidneys. Although ultrasound waves are invisible, they hurt and they leave huge bruies all over your back. I was under anesthesia, you can have a general or epidural with "sedation", and you are pretty much out of it. But I remember coming around during part of the surgery and it hurt. I guess you are too drugged up to care. Afterwards was the bad part. Instead of two or three big stones, you have a thousand small pieces of stone, which hurt like hell. They said once the surgery was over the pain would go away, but I had to stay overnight on the PCA. (morphine drip) So you are weak and in pain and now you have to pass a whole bunch of small stones. There are so many this process can take a whole day or more. Plus you have this horrible urge to urinate and then nothing comes out. I think that feeling is worse than the pain.
So, if the doctors offer you surgery make sure you have all the facts before going in. It wasn't the cure all they said it would be, and I will never do that agian.
OK- I've been rambling on enough now. Please, go to the doctor, get a diagnosis and a prescripion and start drinking massive amounts of liquid.
Sarah
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mslily
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Reged: 09/06/02
Posts: 322
Loc: Cincinnati, OH
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Quincy...I agree that a stone feels nothing like childbirth. I was referring to the level of pain involved in actually passing a stone versus giving birth. Passing my two stones were so excrutiatingly painful for me that I lost consciousness in the hospital twice (the first time) while they had me on the table running some blue stuff through me trying to figure out if a) indeed it was a stone and b) in which kidney it was in. I remember the nurse giving me a lortab for my pain with water and one cracker when I came to and then threw it up about 2 minutes later. So much for pain meds! I also vaguely remember (the first time) when the male nurse carried me out to my mom's car (I was 20), after the blue test (with x-ray screen) so that she could drive me home so that I could pass the stone on my own. It all was really a blur both times. I do remember thinking that I really just wanted to die right then and there than go through any more pain. That constant feeling of having to urinate and you can't squeeze a drop is beyond excrutiating. The first stone I passed later on in the evening...just went to the bathroom, like I had 100 times before that day (with nothing) and just went. I was overjoyed but still in pain (back mostly for me). The second stone passed more easily by comparison and was probably just smaller in size, I assume. If it is a kidney stone that you have, I don't think that you will hesitate to go the ER if the pain gets to be too much. Make sure you have someone nearby to help you as you won't be moving around too much on your own. I remember being in the fetal position crying on the tile floor at my mom's house (sorry for drama, but it's true).
Candice
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jim539
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Reged: 01/07/02
Posts: 9
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I've passed 2 stones. I was never hospitalized but they caused the worst pain I've ever felt. I found the most relief from crawling into a tub with the hottest water I could stand. Pain would reduce immediately. I spent a lot of time over several days in the tub. May not help a golfball sized stone but sure helped my bb sized stone
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14stones
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Reged: 06/18/03
Posts: 336
Loc: On the beach in California
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I am now at 17 stones. I have passed three since i signed onhere a few short months ago. I agree that there is no other pain like it on earth. I have learned allot by coming on these boards about this condition as well. I would say that in passing a stone, just like anything else, we are all different and all have different level of tolerence when it comes to pain and how we deal with it. Like I said, I have passed several stones at home laying on the couch in agony. There have been other times when i couldn't stand up and have actually fainted from the pain. Each stone is usually a different size and therefore it has a different ability to block the ureter. It is by the blocking of the ureter that the majority of the pain is caused. (renel colic) A smaller stone may only partially block the ureter on its way down and therefore you MIGHT be able to deal with the pain like I have on your couch with Lorcet. If the stone completely obstructs your ureter then you will know it instantly and won't be able to do anything except look for the fastest and strongest relief from teh pain that you can.
If you think you may be passing a stone, whether it is big or small, it is always worth going to your pcp. So many variables can happen while passing a stone that it is always smart to get checked out. I had a stone become stuck in its path and it remained that way for over two months. They finally had to go up inside me to remove it. (That was almost as bad as having to pass one) I think that it would be smart to get checked out and hope that you are ok. I too have heard that it is a pain that is "comparable" to childbirth almost everytime I have had to go to the emergency room because of a stone. I think that is all that was being said by the way, that it was the only thing that is comparable to the pain, not that the two were in any way the same thing.
Let me know what happens as I am very curious about other peoples stone situations. I hope all is well and godspeed to you. 
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Go that way really fast, if something gets in your way.....TURN! Always look on the bright side of life.
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scissorhands
Member
Reged: 06/04/03
Posts: 168
Loc: Hell
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Just wanted to thank 14stones aka 17stones, Ragdoll, Mslily, Quincy and Jim539 for all their helpful advice to my post. Being the stubborn person I am and owning my own business I thought taking a day away from work would only be acceptable were I too die in my sleep...
I made it through most of Monday then decided I had to be able to walk in order to work, so I went to that dreaded Drs office...
Good news: It wasn't kidney stones
Bad News: It is one of my cages in my lower back(I have three)and after having an x-ray and MRI, like a slipped disc, I have a slipped cage...
Good News: With all this heat I will be getting some much needed time off...
Bad News: I can't straighten up, have to wear Ninja Turtle brace and get to have more back surgery (#5) and fusion Sept9th...
Everyone here is so kind and caring, I really appreciate knowing there are so many knowledgeable people to turn to when you need advice.
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Baseball is wrong...Man with four balls cannot walk!
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14stones
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Reged: 06/18/03
Posts: 336
Loc: On the beach in California
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No problem. I am sorry that it wasn't kidney stones. I never thought I would say that to anyone in my life. Best of luck with your back and I will keep you in my prayers.
Keep us updated.
Ni
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Go that way really fast, if something gets in your way.....TURN! Always look on the bright side of life.
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quincy
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Reged: 11/07/02
Posts: 333
Loc: pacific northwest
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Hey 14 Stones;
You have had 17 stones? In what time period? You say you've passed 3 in a few months? My God, do they know what kind of stones they are? If they find out what kind of stones they are, then they can figure out what is causing them. In many cases its diet that affects their production. I know that mine are calcium oxalate, which means I have to stop consuming foods with oxalte in them. That is stuff like tea, coffee, colas, chocolate, strawberries and most dark leafy greens like spinach. Of all of those, tea is the worst. I have had to cut back on my tea intake, and I used to drink tea a lot. Hot tea instead of coffee and iced tea all day. Now I drink coffee. Sometimes I will ignore the dangers and start drinking tea again and I will have a stone within a few months.
I know that some people make stones no matter what-I think they are caused by gout or an overabundance of uric acid. I am just curious to know why you have so many and what is being done about them.
Be well,
Quincy 
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mslily
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Reged: 09/06/02
Posts: 322
Loc: Cincinnati, OH
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I'm glad that you went to your physician and now know what you are dealing with. On one hand, it is good that it isn't kidney stones, but I'm sorry to hear that another surgery is in your future. Thanks for keeping us updated on your progress.
Candice
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14stones
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Reged: 06/18/03
Posts: 336
Loc: On the beach in California
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Hi. I have now had 17 Stones over a four year period. I have been seeing a nephrologyst for about three of the years. I am one of the lucky people who, no matter what I eat, drink or do, I will form stones. In fact, I have an additional 12 stones in my right kidney and 8 in my left.
They just started one day four years ago and haven't let up since. They are simple calcium oxolate stones. I usually don't grow stones bigger than 5 to 6 mm but have had a couple that were in the 8 range.
The small ones I can pass at home but anything over 3mm I have to go to the E room and get some serious relief. I had never heard about anyone faking stone pain before I came to this site and still don't see how anyone could be able to do it but, sadly as I have said before, it explains allot about how I have been treated over the past year or so in the E room. I am lucky enough to have always passed a stone while there and always shown one on a catscan. There was one time where I went in and passed my stone while waiting to be admitted (I was taken to a Kaiser hospital and I guess I didn't fit in or something as I had to wait almost 20 minutes before the nurse would even talk to my wife and the place was mostly empty). The funny thing is that I handed the stone to the doctor and was covered in urine and blood and he told me to sit down and I was recovering from passing the stone without taking anything for it and a nurse came up and gave me shot of morophine while I was looking the other way. I told her that I had already passed the stone but she had started the shot and wasn't going to stop.
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Go that way really fast, if something gets in your way.....TURN! Always look on the bright side of life.
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quincy
Board Addict
Reged: 11/07/02
Posts: 333
Loc: pacific northwest
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Yeah, its pretty easy for someone to fake stone pain. The first symptom is of course, pain and blood in the urine. Addicts will fake pain and then when the doctor asks for a urine sample, they will prick their finger and put a drop of blood in the urine while they are in the bathroom. You usually have to wait at least a little while before you can do any testing like a Cat-scan or an xray. Meanwhile, no doctor will leave you suffering so they usually prescribe something right away. So you can see how someone could abuse the system. Actually my former doctors office treated me really crappy after I didn't pass the stone right away and they had given me narcotics. After that I always had to go and get a CT first before I would get any pain meds. They must have flagged me as a drug-seeker because when I went to the urologist they wouldnt' prescribe anything either and that is usually the first thing they do for a stone. I had to suffer for awhile before they would do anything and even then they didn't want to give me anything. I wanted to ask you; when the stones are still in the kidney, do they hurt you? Well they hurt me. But I have had lots of doctors tell me that since the stone is in the kidney, it shouldn't hurt. I think that is Best if kept off the board. It may not be as severe as when it is coming down or in the bladder, but it still hurts. Its like a real bad backache with pain that shoots down towards the bladder. But still at least 5 docs have told me that stones in the kidney don't hurt you. They blame it on a regular backache. One had the gall to send me to PT for my backache!! This was after he saw the stone in my kidney, several of them in fact. I couldn't even get an ultram!! Finally I went to the ER where they took care of me, and the jerk called and told the doctors to watch out, he thought I was drug seeking!! The ER doc told him that I had two kidney stones and that he was treating me for pain. My primary doc was so mad he told the doc if I accept any narcotics from the ER, that he will discharge me. When the ER doc told me this he recommended I get another doctor, since this guy didn't know what he was doing. I was surprised because docs usually stick up for each other, but this guy knew I was for real. Come on! Two stones and Im faking the pain!??! It just kills me the lenght doctors will go to to prevent you from taking any narcotics.
Quincy
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