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Meds, Medical Conditions, and Treatment >> Meds, Medical Conditions, and Treatment

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nlehman
Stranger


Reged: 06/29/04
Posts: 17
Fentanyl Withdrawal
      #186695 - 09/14/04 08:35 AM

I have been using the Duragesic 75 patch for several months. On top of that I use at least 6 10/325 hydros a day. I ran out of patches early this month because I lost 2 of them while swimming on a camping trip. I had also been changing them every two days instead of three days like my doctor prescribed. It seems to me that I don't get any relief on the third day of wearing the patch. Needless to say, I thought all of these people who had talked about how horrible withdrawal was were exaggerating. I thought that I could do this with no problem because most people said it's like having the flu. I ran out of patches and hydro 5 days ago. I thought that I could use some fiorinal for the withdrawal symptoms, but it didn't really help when I tried it. This withdrawal thing has to be the worst thing that I have ever felt in my entire life!!! I'd rather be in labor giving birth to a 15 pound baby with no epidural than to be going through this!!! From everything that I'd read, I thought that the withdrawals got significantly better after about 3 days. It's been 5 and I feel like I am going crazy. I finally broke down and ordered some hydro from an OP. Have any of you ever been successfully tapered off of the duragesic patch? How did you do it? How long did you feel bad?

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jbnugget
Newbie


Reged: 11/14/02
Posts: 44
Loc: Boston area
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: nlehman]
      #186705 - 09/14/04 09:32 AM

Depending on total opiate dose/day, the half life of the opioids & a person's idiosyncrasies, physical W/D can take as long as a day or 2 to start - or, at least, it can take that long b4 you begin to really feel like crud. Because psych addiction is also a big piece of the picture you may still feel lousy for weeks after the physical stuff is largely gone. Sometimes, the 2 are hard to distinguish. The depression during a detox has always been the toughest aspect for me. One doc told me that it can even be MONTHS b4 you feel 'normal' again.

If you have a good relationship w/your doc you might want to call ASAP and talk about what's going on. Especially mention the 2-day effectiveness of the patches.

Good Luck. I know how awful it can be. PM me if you want to 'talk' about anything else (more details of my experiences, my methods to help feel better, your experience, etc).

jbnugget


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mas
Journeyman


Reged: 04/06/04
Posts: 85
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: jbnugget]
      #186708 - 09/14/04 10:02 AM

Hi... I have not tapered off the patch, but I am on it. I am on 50mcg's... and it's not just YOU. The patch only lasts 2 days on most active adults. I now am allowed to change mine at 60 hours, which is very helpful. But, I still have a 24 hour period with significant pain, which is why I order Norco for breakthru meds. My doc will not give short-acting narcotics for breakthru's, so I have no choice as most people on the patch, or even oxycontin, are also prescribed breakthru's.

Even my pharmacist thinks the prescribing information should change. His father is also on the patch, and changes every 48 hours. I just want you to know that you are not alone, and that even professionals believe the dosage to be inadequate. The problem with the patch on active adults is that it is meant (originally) for geriactrics and terminally ill patients, who were not active. In reality, from what I understand, the more active you are, the less likely the patch is to last 72 hours.

I take many Norco on 'day 3'. My husband knows every third day is gonna be tough... 'i am day-3-ing' is what I call it. It takes several norco at a time to break the pain, every 4-6 hours, for about 18-24 hours, but then I can get by on days' 1 & 2 of the new patch without many breakthru's for the most part. Sometimes it's not easy... but it's better than life without med's at all. By far.

I think you need to talk to your doctor. I also lost 2 patches this month... a mistake. My husband put my new ones on me before he left for work, while I was sleeping with our sick son, whom I had been up with all nite. When I got up, I went to take off my old patches (I had not changed at 60 hours, forgot, so it was 72 hours when this happened) I accidentally took off the NEW ones instead of the OLD ones and threw them in the toilet. I all of the sudden realized I may have made a mistake, called husband in a panic... he told me that yes I had taken off the new ones. I got them out of the toilet, rinsed them off... called the doc, not there. so called pharmacist, who told me they were no good.
I put them back on anyway. I am gonna have to pay out of pocket this month for about 10 days of patches, as our insurance is cancelled for this month. Husband started new job, no insurance until Oct. 1st. Anyway, the absolute worst possible time for a loss. So, I kept on the barely working patches for a full 48 hours. It was not too bad, they must have been working somewhat, but I did go thru almost all of the rest of my Norco (from an OP).

I guess what I am saying is, I think you should talk to your doc. What I also do, which I have not told doc, but don't think is a problem, is I overlap the patches for 12 hours, since it takes the new one 12 hours to kick in, and the old one 12 hours to completely leave your system... I put the new ones on at 60 hours and take the old ones off at 72. I have found this to be the key to the maximum pain-free period obtainable. COnsider trying this as well, if you can get the doc to change you at 60 hours. It is not gonna help to up your dosage, it will still wear off at 48 hours, unfortunately.

Now, my doc was prescribing 2-25 mcg patches at a time, don't ask me why. So, that means #25 -25mcg patches a month. My new insurance will NOT cover more than 15 patches even with an override, so I have to get him to change it... which will not be easy. I have to have him script 2 boxes of 50's, and 1 box of 25's. That is the only way to give me the closest quantity, while keeping within my insurance rules. I think he is afraid of the higher dose ones, my pharmacist says he does this alot, and even asked my doc once (about another patient) of just switching to the higher dose, at which point my doc went off on the pharmacist. Weird, I don't understand why I have to wear 2 patches intead of just one most of the time. He even gave me the 50's once, but only for one month, and then switched back to 2-25's. I am getting off track, just wondered if you maybe know something I don't?

I am so very sorry you are going thru this. I can't believe you have gone 5 days already. Is there any possibility you can talk to your doctor about changing your dosage-length?

I would definately order Norco to help ease the withdrawls, and I HIGHLY recommend using Nyquil and Immodium caplets (Nyquil has a chemical called DXM which is chemically related to morphine, and Immodium IS an OPIATE, which will feed the opiod receptors, but does not cross the blood-brain barrier... I have even seen it recommended for Heroin withdrawl, so I am sure it will help you some) I have used both quite successfully when holiday'ing from my meds... please give it a try, they really, really work, with a little IBU and maybe a muscle relaxer.

good luck, hope this helps.
mas


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trixxie
Member


Reged: 05/23/03
Posts: 121
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: nlehman]
      #186948 - 09/15/04 07:14 PM

I did something similar, but I wanted off the patch, couldn't find any info on tapering..cept the usual. Step down to the lower patch dosage, and not lay the entire patch on.
I moved from the 50mcg to no patch, but I had oxycodone for help, I also had some ativan for the restless,cramping legs.
It took me 3 weeks to get the med out of my system.
You can do, but call your doctor and let me know that you were not getting adequate relief from the patch.

PM me anytime, if you feel like it.

You should be over the worst of it. Some have a harder time than others...

--------------------
The truth shall set you free!


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Daeshay76
Board Addict


Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 376
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: mas]
      #186963 - 09/15/04 09:25 PM

Nyquil has a chemical called DXM which is chemically related to morphine

I am just curious on this one...do you just take the reg. dose or do you up the dose on this when you go on a holiday? i have never heard of this before so i am very curious on how much to take of this when i do go on a holiday which i feel will be comming up soon due to tolerance issues...thanks for the info


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Luca_Brasi
Enthusiast


Reged: 12/01/03
Posts: 237
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: nlehman]
      #186967 - 09/15/04 09:57 PM

Quote:

I thought all of these people who had talked about how horrible withdrawal was were exaggerating. I thought that I could do this with no problem because most people said it's like having the flu. I ran out of patches and hydro 5 days ago. I thought that I could use some fiorinal for the withdrawal symptoms, but it didn't really help when I tried it. This withdrawal thing has to be the worst thing that I have ever felt in my entire life!!! I'd rather be in labor giving birth to a 15 pound baby with no epidural than to be going through this!!! From everything that I'd read, I thought that the withdrawals got significantly better after about 3 days. It's been 5 and I feel like I am going crazy. I finally broke down and ordered some hydro from an OP. Have any of you ever been successfully tapered off of the duragesic patch? How did you do it? How long did you feel bad?




INDEED! I'm in the same boat. Sick as a dog. Last time it lasted 2 weeks. I found that imodium ad and Vicks 44 cough drops ACTIVE ING: DXM, helps a tad bit. And Motrin helps with the aches and pains. Let me warn you, NEVER EVER touch benzo's IF YOU THINK OPIOID W/D IS BAD! This is a pick-nick in comparison!!!! WORDS CAN NOT DESCRIBE-- Stay away from Xanax, Valium, Ativan, Ect. Some may tell you they will help with your opioid w/d, and they would, but if you play that game, your playing with the devil. You could find yourself hooked on BOTH! Just stick it out. You'll make it. It's hard.. I'm doing it too. So PM if you like. God bless you. Hope you feel well soon. If you can just hold out 9 more days, you'll be okay!!! Take care.

p.s. Up the holliday dose of DXM, but make sure the only active ingr. is dextromethorphan!!! Nyquil has other AI's that could be very bad in large doses. I drank half a bottle of pure dextromethorphan. NASTY. It was mild relief. Better than none, eh?

For more info on DXM please see: http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dxm/dxm.shtml


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RITT
Stranger


Reged: 08/26/04
Posts: 1
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: nlehman]
      #186971 - 09/15/04 10:39 PM

Withdrawl from Fentanyl might be possible with the administration of clonidine, you can also substitute methadone (but where ya gonna get that?) or a long-acting agonist, or with the reintroduction of the original addicting agent if available .
A tapered course over 3 weeks should get the job done.
Clonidine is used in opioid detox in hospital settings....(which if you can't tell is where I am from.) Doseage should be as follows 0.1 to 0.2 mg of oral clonidine every 4 hours as needed for control of the withdrawal syndrome for up to 7 days...Maybe this will help someone.


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Daeshay76
Board Addict


Reged: 03/22/04
Posts: 376
Re: Fentanyl Withdrawal [Re: Luca_Brasi]
      #187005 - 09/16/04 10:17 AM

Luca_Brasi
....just wondering how everything is going...please PM whenever you need to...k? i wish all of you the best of luck with the w/d i know how bad they are and how bad they make you feel but dont give up right now i am going through w/d from xanax and it is pure He$$...my doc put me on catapres patches along with some anti-sezuire meds but still i am feeling a bit terrible...i have cut my dose down from 2mgs of xanax at bedtime to 1 mg so next week i will be cutting that as well to .5mg so hopefully by the 1st of oct. i will be totally off this med.


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