oxy20
Journeyman
Reged: 10/06/02
Posts: 51
Loc: ct
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My pain doc blew me off cause i ran out of meds early and told me to go to detox....soooo i got my records from him so i could go to another doc.....well well well guess what the records he gave me are not mine they are some guys named travis's records.....my question is can this idiot pain doc get in trouble for giving me someone else's records and who do i report him to..... this is 2 good 2 b true.....heeee heee hee he idiot !
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scrabblitis
Newbie

Reged: 04/08/04
Posts: 45
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I don't know if there's any legal recourse for getting the wrong records or not - I would think that maybe mistakes like that are somewhat tolerable? I'm not sure - just guessing here. I do think you should take some time to calm down though, before making a decision to risk a mans career Don't do this out of spite, after all, it's not the Doctors fault you ran out of your meds early!
However - your Dr. did the right thing by NOT filling your pain med script early - you're not supposed to run out before your 30 days are up!
If pain Dr's are not VERY stringent, they'll draw attention from the DEA and lose their license - then EVERY patient that Doc has, will lose their pain management benefits, and the Dr. will have no way to support his family - not to mention all those horrible lawyer bills!
If you don't mind my asking - why did you run out early?
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Brain cells come, and brain cells go; But fat cells live forever
~Anonymous
I am not young enough to know everything ~Oscar Wilde
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wren
Enthusiast
Reged: 06/01/02
Posts: 295
Loc: up north & homesick for the di...
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Just my guess,but most people run out because they are usually more often than not underprescribed for their pain.I don't know if that is their case for sure or not,but I do not consider myself an abuser but cannot count the times I have run out early.Sometimes it can be hard to sit and suffer when you know you have relief sitting in your medicine cabinet.My guess is that MOST people on this board if asked would say they had run out early a time or two.ANd it would be my guess that someone,whether it is the Dr. or not I do not know but someone would be in some hot water for those files.There are some big laws out there regarding folks medical privacy and I am sure if you were to tell this Travis you had been given his medical records he might not be so happy either! Geezzzz I can think of a couple Drs.I would love to catch on any kind of a screw up....Good luck to you and I hope you are able to find another Dr. to treat your pain.... Wren
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its all fun & games til someone puts an eye out,then its still fun ,you just can't see***
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oxy20
Journeyman
Reged: 10/06/02
Posts: 51
Loc: ct
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Hi scrabblitis thanks 4 your reply....the reason i ran out early is cause like most people on this board i am under medicated.... i get extreme violent cutting pains all over the ole body , its really unreal the pain can at times actually cause me to black out.... i really don't want 2 take gosh dang pills but i have no choice....thanks again 4 your reply..
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konagirl222
Newbie
Reged: 12/16/03
Posts: 37
Loc: Hawaii
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Just goes to show we ALL make mistakes. You run out of meds early, the doc gives you the wrong records. Presented to the doc in a sympathetic, understanding way s/he may reconsider your situation. How you handle the situation will determine the outcome.
Just my 2 cents.
KG
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oxy20
Journeyman
Reged: 10/06/02
Posts: 51
Loc: ct
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thanks konagirl222 that was really understanding and smart....thanks a lot for those words.....took your advise and sent the doc this fax (below)
i am sorry for not telling u i ran out early cause the subject is so taboo .... but i did run out early cause i am getting cut n stabbed to death ,i mean what i have is like extreme severe violent long knife cuts in my leg and feet that can at times actually make me pass out.so i would hope you could understand the possibility of running out a bit early at times and the prospect of going 4 detox is really not an option as i will still b getting cut n stabbed to death..... i do feel bad about not telling you but again i felt that the subject is so bad.... i really do not want 2 take pills 4 anything and am darn tired of it.... so please accept my appoligy.....
also i must tell you that i am not being mean or bad or anything but you guys sent me someone's elses records ,someone by the name of travis.. just telling you so you can have your people be more carefull and i am also concerned that someone else will get my records.....
again sorry for the misunderstanding
xxx xxxxxx
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 474
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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Hold up there... in another post, didn't you say your doc was previously giving you 90# 20mg oxy's a month????????? Most of us only WISH our docs. would give us that much! I'm sorry, but it also sounds like you were on a contract... it's a contract that states your meds must last a certain time frame... if you call and ask for a refill early, you have violated the contract and they have every right to cut you off. If I'm wrong about the contract thing, my apologies, but it sounds from what I've read of your posting, that is exactly what happened and if so, you really should have read the contract and stuck by it. My contract was for a fraction of what you were prescribed... 20# 5mg oxys that MUST last 28 days. That is also the reason for the pee test, which you mentioned previously.
Sorry, but I'm in the habit of calling a spade a spade. Again, if there was a typo or I've misunderstood something, please accept my apologies... but if not... you need to be honest with yourself here... as well as others.
Edit: from your post about being honest... "90 20mg oxy and 20 40mg methadone.....well on my last visit i was handed a cup 2 pee in well i had nothing in my system cause i ran out so the pain doc blew me off and told me to go to a detox...." I'm not passing judgement on you, but if you were taking any more medication than this, it couldn't be healthy for you. Also, you said you were undermedicated... imagine your doc having given you what mine gave to me... it wouldn't even begin to touch your pain. 90# 20 mg oxy's and 20# 40mg methadone a month??? Hon, that's like 60 mg's of oxy a day with 20 mg's of methadone to get you through the month. I honestly am not passing judgement on you... but I do think you need to take a long hard look at why your doc. may have cut you off.
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
Edited by Greycie (06/22/04 04:17 PM)
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kayleighbear
Member
Reged: 12/01/03
Posts: 102
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Holy cow lady! I pop on over here and here you go again.... blah blah blahh... but I'm not passing judgement. I'd say that's just what you do! Get over yourself and maybe you should take a long hard look at how "caring" you sound when you post here and in other forums. NOT!
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 474
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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kayleigh,
If you have a personal problem with me, keep it personal, would you? I believe the forum is for sharing experience and advice, not personally attacking somebody because you just don't like what they have to say. I'm not going to be baited with your feeble attempt at getting me riled up. Just not worth it.
PS... my post was based upon the facts as presented, that's it. If you don't like it, just don't read it.
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
Edited by Greycie (06/23/04 09:14 AM)
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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I highly doubt it was the DOCTOR who made the clerical error. Why do people always want to sue? Were YOU injured by the mix-up with patient records? Did YOU read someone ELSE'S records? Once you saw they weren't yours, you should have immediately returned them and protected that privacy about which you are wanting that doc to get in trouble over now. It was a mistake, albeit a serious one.
2 b honest or not to b honest
As I posted in the OTHER thread, there are some issues I have with what you posted originally. For reminders sake, your original post from "2 b honest or not to b honest":
Quote:
Need some advice .... ill try not to make this to long... I have nuropathy i get like extreme severe knife cuts all over my body the pain is violent it can actually make me pass out.... well i was seeing a pain doc and was getting 90 20mg oxy and 20 40mg methadone.....well on my last visit i was handed a cup 2 pee in well i had nothing in my system cause i ran out so the pain doc blew me off and told me to go to a detox.... so i made an appt. at my old nuroligest who was giving me 60 20mg oxy he was a pretty nice guy who once caught me double dipping norco from 2 doc's and instead of blowing me off put me on oxy,couldn't believe that.....well my question is should i just tell him i want 2 come back 2 him or should i tell him the truth that i got blown off by the pain doc for failing the pee test.... i have 2 c him at 4pm today.....ideas ???
p.s. i think that the nuroligest did not blow me off from the double dipping cause he understands the nerve problem that i have and knows its a real big problem..... its like having an invisible buddy walking around with you slashing you with a extreme jagged knife from hell....
You have admitted to multiple issues here (double dipping, taking too much of your medication, etc.) so why in the world would you feel the DOCTOR would be responsible for YOUR BEHAVIOR which put you into withdrawal and was the direct reason you were discontinued to begin with? I just get the feeling you want him to pay for YOUR behavior. Your doctor was protecting himself by discharging you--especially if it was a pain clinic.
I'm sorry, but like other posters have said, you were LUCKY to have a sympathetic doctor. It is REALLY HARD to feel sorry for someone because their own behavior resulted in the loss of the prescription priveleges. And I really hope you gain some clarity over the situation and don't try to blame your doctor for letting you go.
If I am misunderstanding something here, PLEASE correct me.
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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wren
Enthusiast
Reged: 06/01/02
Posts: 295
Loc: up north & homesick for the di...
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Sorry Graycy but your post does sound very much like an attack,and why would he care to compare what you are prescribed to what he is prescribed,there are probably very logical reasons for that ie. being 2 different people,you might be 100 pounds,he might weigh 300,your pain might be a 5 his might be a 10. His pain sounds truly unimaginable and I hope he found some help yesterday.I think all he ever wanted to know was how to go about being honest with his Doc,not to be attacked for asking.It certainly isn't anyones job on here to decide that he is taking too much.It does sound like he made the right decision with his fax to his Dr. and I do hope the Doc has found some compassion,and if the DOC feels he is taking too much I hope he will point him in the right direction for help. Good Luck and take care, Wren
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its all fun & games til someone puts an eye out,then its still fun ,you just can't see***
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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I respectfully disagree. I very much support Greycie's post. Read the other thread and you will see that 2+2=4.
It isn't that she (or I) are trying make a diagnosis of somebody with a problem or say that the original poster doesn't NEED so much medication. She and I are both saying there is something wrong with this picture. I encourage you and kayleighbear to both read the previous thread (or my previous post in this thread) and see where WE are coming from.
It isn't a judgment! It's the FACTS. It certainly isn't a flame to say that self-admitted ABUSE of the medication is what it is. Nobody is saying there isn't pain there. Just that it isn't the DOCTOR'S fault that the original poster was cut off from his narc prescriptions for that behavior of using more than was prescribed. Those people who are lucky enough to find pain management that works certainly wouldn't want to lose it because of a moment (or two or three or four) of instant gratification.
Trust me, I have several VERY PAINFUL medical problems. I hurt ALL THE TIME and there are days an extra pill would be wonderful. But I don't do it. Because it is a violation of my pain contract. Because I don't want to lose my great doctor. Because if it hurts THAT bad, I can call the office and ASK in advance. If they say no, you stay on schedule--period. It's a play now, pay later approach when you use more of your meds than you are supposed to. It's an awful cycle to get caught up in!
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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scrabblitis
Newbie

Reged: 04/08/04
Posts: 45
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Oxy -
I'm very sorry if I sounded as though I wasn't empathetic towards your pain - That was definatly NOT the tone I wanted to portray so if I left you with that impression - I truly apologize.
I should have been more clear. What I meant was not that I thought you were not in pain, or not needing your pain meds, just that when a Dr. is prescribing narcotics on a long term basis - they cannot replace missing medications, often w/o a police report or something of that nature - otherwise they will risk coming under the very watchful eye of the DEA. Sometimes it'll even be the pharmacy or insurance company that turns the Dr. in - if they see you filling early very often at all.
I am very sorry that you were left high and dry by your Dr. though, with what sounds like a trememdous amount of pain. Having gone back and read the doses you mentioned taking - I can't even begin to fathom that those doses would even come CLOSE to covering the pain you're in.
I truly hope you will find a compassionate Dr. who will prescribe you what you need to keep your pain under control - and again, I apologize if I sounded unsympathetic to your situation.
In regards to getting the Dr. in trouble for the records problem - I kind of figure it like this: If he's prescribing long term opiates to you (even though they're not sufficient enough), he is probably trying to keep other patients out of pain too - and it would be a huge shame to have him "fired" or lose his license over this, leaving his other pain patients in the same position you are in right now - I hope that makes sense 
Anyway, I really do wish you the best of luck in finding a new Dr. - and I feel so badly for the tremendous pain you are suffering from
Very Sincerely & Apologetically,
~Scrabby
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Brain cells come, and brain cells go; But fat cells live forever
~Anonymous
I am not young enough to know everything ~Oscar Wilde
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scrabblitis
Newbie

Reged: 04/08/04
Posts: 45
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Quote:
Hold up there... in another post, didn't you say your doc was previously giving you 90# 20mg oxy's a month????????? Most of us only WISH our docs. would give us that much!...........
My contract was for a fraction of what you were prescribed... 20# 5mg oxys that MUST last 28 days. That is also the reason for the pee test, which you mentioned previously............
Edit: from your post about being honest... "90 20mg oxy and 20 40mg methadone.....
I'm not passing judgement on you, but if you were taking any more medication than this, it couldn't be healthy for you. Also, you said you were undermedicated... imagine your doc having given you what mine gave to me... it wouldn't even begin to touch your pain. 90# 20 mg oxy's and 20# 40mg methadone a month??? Hon, that's like 60 mg's of oxy a day with 20 mg's of methadone to get you through the month......
I'm sorry Greycie - normally I agree with your opinions, but in this case I have to disagree.
You seem to be really stuck on HOW MUCH he is prescribed - rather than the problem he came here to find ideas on how to solve - whether or not to be honest with his Dr., and if to be honest - what & how to say it?
As far as "how much" he's taking - that's a drop in the bucket for the type of pain he is describing! My Gawd! Can you imagine going through life every single day feeling like you're being repeatedly cut & stabbed all over your body? To have pain SO GREAT that you actually PASS OUT!? I too suffer from some pretty painful Best if kept off the board - but I dont' even think on my WORST days that my pain could come even REMOTELY close to what he says he is suffering with.
I have, and still do, know people on chronic pain plans. I know one person, an elderly lady, who is prescribed 40mgs of Oxycontin 4 times daily (120mg); and 6 of the 5mg Oxycodone for Break-Thru pain (an additional 30mg) daily. That is a grand total of 150mg of Oxycodone intake daily, and this persons Dr. is always concerned about her pain being UNDERTREATED! She functions VERY well on these medications. Of course she didn't start out on that dose, she worked up to it over the course of about 4 years. My only regret is that her Dr. only takes geriatric patients
I know another person who goes to a Pain Clinic who gets 180mg of MsContin daily, but no BT pain meds. Her does is not enough to cover her pain, and she has chosen to live her life "2 weeks on, 2 weeks off" - meaning that for 2 weeks out of the month, she is pain free - the other 2 weeks she has nothing to take for her pain because she took it during the 1st 2 weeks. Her rationalization is that it is easier for her to function through life if at least SOME of her days are pain tolerable, rather than ALL of her days being intolerable. She said that if she ONLY took the 180mgs every day, it would be very difficult for her to do the simplest of tasks. I believe her whole heartedly, she is a friend of the family and I've spent a lot of time with her - enough to know she's not lying.
So just because you only got scripted 20 Oxycodone every 28 days, doesn't mean that a dose that is 100 times that should cover someone elses pain. I'm sure that eventually, it will take MORE than that to cover your pain, years down the road, as your tolerance gradually builds. It sounds more like maybe you're jealous of the dosage he is given - which would be totally understandable. Every single one of us here would like to have a Dr. who would prescribe for us the medications needed to be pain free.
JMHO
Scrabby
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Brain cells come, and brain cells go; But fat cells live forever
~Anonymous
I am not young enough to know everything ~Oscar Wilde
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 474
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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You are certainly all entitled to your opinions, and I cant help or change the fact youve misinterpreted what was being said for something other that it was. I wont apologize for my post as Ive said, and it has been reiterated, I am merely posting observations based on the facts as they have been presented; thats it. I will, for those of you who have seemingly missed that, point out a few of those for you- hopefully this will help you see the post for how it was, not for how youve perceived it to be.
Scrabby: you posted immediately
well not even go to that post
but you asked why he ran out early
to which Wren posted: most people run out because they are usually more often than not underprescribed for their pain. Mr. Oxy, after having posted the amount of medication he was taking in a prior post then replied: the reason i ran out early is cause like most people on this board i am under medicated. Based on this information, I took the facts and presented them telling somebody not to be dishonest. Thats it. In fact, I will also point out what I stated was about contracts and violating them and if you do, you can very well be cut off- its in the contract. Thats a fact, not a judgment. Had I been passing judgment, I would have stated exactly how I feel about this behavior, I didnt even touch that. Additionally, I stated that, but if you were taking any more medication than this, it couldn't be healthy for you.
You guys need to not read things into missives that arent there, and you clearly have. I was and am concerned about the mans health, for one, and also pointing out that if hes violated his narcotics contract, then his doc. Had every right to cut him off- that is a fact- a legal fact and not a judgment, lol.
Scrabby? Am I jealous???????? Seriously??????? LOL. No. I wouldnt be functioning if I was on that much medication. I was merely trying to make a point. That is a LOT of medication for a person to be taking
for any condition. I see issues like this every day and that is a lot. And I wont begin to pretend that his tolerance level isn't so high that he needs that much
I dont know that, but my post had nothing to do with whether he should be taking that much or whether I thought it was a good idea or not
it was about how healthy that was and reasons as to why his Doc. May have cut him off. I dont post based on emotion- I have neither the time nor desire. Just try to give people a perspective they otherwise may not have seen.
Oh, but as for his pain being a 10 and mine a 5
pain scales are merely subjective, lol. Thats neither here nor there
I wasnt trying to compare our pain
just trying to give an example of the high dose hes getting. I dont see cancer patients getting that much medication when undergoing daily chemo and radiation therapy. Just an observation. Still, it has nothing to do with that. I absolutely believe he must need the amount of medication hes receiving or his doctor would NOT give it to him. Not that much. But!!! *IF* hes on a contract, he must abide by the rules of the contract and if hes run out
there is no problem with that in the medical worlds eyes as long as he doesnt call up asking for more. This is where one gets a red flag. Again, crabby
I am *stuck* on what hes been prescribed because I fear for his health were he prescribed anymore
as clearly does his doctor or he wouldnt have put him on a contract to begin with nor would he have cut him off when he asked for more. And I totally 100% agree with night_shade in the aspect of his running out early, taking a pee test and then testing negative for the drugs hes been prescribed??? Something doesnt add up.
I wont even touch the elderly woman or family friend comment
you wont want to hear my comments on that and this post has nothing to do with that and that has nothing to do with fact or advice
neither of which youve asked me for so on that topic, I will keep it zipped. I will, however, reiterate some of what night_shade has said because she hit it right on the nail with:
It isn't that she (or I) are trying make a diagnosis of somebody with a problem or say that the original poster doesn't NEED so much medication. She and I are both saying there is something wrong with this picture.
It isn't a judgment! It's the FACTS.
Nobody is saying there isn't pain there. Just that it isn't the DOCTOR'S fault that the original poster was cut off from his narc prescriptions for that behavior of using more than was prescribed. Those people who are lucky enough to find pain management that works certainly wouldn't want to lose it because of a moment (or two or three or four) of instant gratification.
You cant begin to fathom my pain
nor can I yours
I have a VERY high tolerance for pain and refuse to accept limitations for my own life. This post is not about my pain, nor anybody elses
but I will say my oldest sister thinks shes dying and being tortured mercilessly when she has a simple cold
you stated: My Gawd! Can you imagine going through life every single day feeling like you're being repeatedly cut & stabbed all over your body? No, not all over my body
but what I can imagine is living every single day of my life feeling as though somebody has shoved a nail the size of a dagger into my spine
right next to my hips. I can imagine not getting more than 1 hour of uninterrupted sleep at night because my hips feel as though theyve been shattered and I cannot move my lower body and have to continually adjust myself by using my upper body to do so.. I can imagine a lot
because I live it. Dont assume what you dont know. I am not jealous of this mans medication dosage- quite frankly, I believe with everything in me if I had that much, it would kill me. But, again, neither here nor there.
You have every right to disagree with me, but I have not been nasty with this man, again, merely pointed out facts as they have been presented. Thats it. You have read more into my post than was there. Still, there is no reason for such hostility because you disagree with somebodys post. Oh, and in reference to hostility, I'm referring to Kayleigh's post... unnecessary.
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
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rockystuart
Enthusiast

Reged: 03/11/04
Posts: 232
Loc: San Fran Bay Area, Calif
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Only real relavant thing I see is about pain scales being subjective. See with me a 10 means I will fall down and scream until they knock me out. 8 means I can't walk far. 9 means caNNOT STAND.
jUST LEARN TO SCREAM WITH YOUR MOUTH SHUT i WAS TOLD BY ONE DOCTOR!
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 474
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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Pretty much... when they hand me a pain scale and tell me to say which one I fall under... for me, what may feel like a 4 is registering as an 8 on their scale. Totally subjective. For me, a 10 is when I can't get out of bed because I literally can't move.. a 9 would be those days when I try to stand, but because of the pain, cannot and must grab ahold of the first thing I can find to hold myself up lest I fall to the floor.
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
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webepi42
Journeyman
Reged: 10/31/02
Posts: 79
Loc: central United States
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contact the person who's records you have and let them KNOW what happened. That is the person who has to deciede what if anything is to be done. According to HEAPA or whatever - the doc could get into trouble for being careless but the person who's records were released to you is the one with a b-t-h not you. Good luck
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webepi42
Journeyman
Reged: 10/31/02
Posts: 79
Loc: central United States
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I have a question. This pain doc or any pain doc. they will "cut" people off just like that? I understand the contract and I understand you have to abide by it but..... A doctor "first do NO HARM" would simply force a person into w/d's. Thats nuts. People DIE from withdrawls. I would think they would assist a person to tapper off and not just dump them. What do they do if someone dies? Blame the patient?
Just wondering 
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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Quote:
This pain doc or any pain doc. they will "cut" people off just like that? I understand the contract and I understand you have to abide by it but..... A doctor "first do NO HARM" would simply force a person into w/d's. Thats nuts. People DIE from withdrawls.
1) YES. They can and will cut you off if you do not abide by the terms of your OPIOIDS contract. Many contracts have an "immediate detox" clause stating that if you are discontinued for violation of the contract, you will be tapered over a one week period. Mine does (it's 2 weeks for me, because I am on methadone.) If you can't or don't intend to follow the rules of your contract, you should EXPECT to be abruptly discontinued if you are caught!!! It's the rules, baby! If you run a red light and a cop catches you, you are gonna get in trouble! Case closed.
2) Your logic is faulted. The doctor IS trying to help a pain patient when he prescribes opioids. That doctor also must cover his/her own butt by instituting the contract and discontinuing a patient if there is a violation--as IT IS A VIOLATION OF FEDERAL LAW IF A DOCTOR PRESCRIBES OPIOIDS TO SOMEONE S/HE KNOWS IS ABUSING THEM. Why would you expect any doctor to risk their practice, their FREEDOM because someone else couldn't take their medication appropriately?
3) In NO WAY does either point number 1 or 2 suggest a patient doesn't have pain, is a junkie, or whatever. I am ONLY saying (since some people here are having trouble grasping this concept) that the rules are the rules. Doctors have to follow them and so do patients.
4) Finally, we are talking ONLY about opioids here. Death by withdrawal happens usually only with METHADONE...and then usually only in people who are on HIGH doses for a long period of time. The reason for this is that most opioids have short half-lives (about 1-3 hours) including oxycodone. Methadone's half-life is 48 hours.
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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PrivateRealm
Threadhead
Reged: 03/18/03
Posts: 904
Loc: usa
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Why would you want to report him? Simply to get back at him? That is childish. Everyone makes mistakes. Just like you made a big one by not following your dosing instructions on your meds.
My meds by no means cut out my pain, but they make them bearable, so I follow my dosage instructions, and on better days, I cut back for those worse days. I wouldn't want to run out and put my self in a bad situation. Why would you expect your Dr. to give you more med? He already gave you enough had you followed your dosage.
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KeriAnne~~~
"Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take - but by the moments that take our breath away."
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