justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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I need anyone to please help me with this. I have a WONDERFUL and CAREING DR who has given me Buprenorphine injections to start today but I have a problem. Im kind of confused. He gave me 150 Norco and told me to take my usual dosage for 4 days which I did. Now today is the day for starting my injections and I woke up and waited as long as I could until I started feeling like poop. I did the injection as he showed me (after spilling one vial) and then waited and waited and started feeling worse and worse and worse and then getting jittery and now full withdrawel has set in! OMG! What do I do? I called and they are out today! Lord help! I don't think I can take another shot for a while. Well after I panicked, guess what I did, I called the answering service and left a message for them to call back, then I took some hydro! Please no blast. Please no ugly comments. Ive already chastised myself and I know I am a failure. I am a loser. I just have to do it tomarrow. I just panicked and freaked out. I thought it was supposed to help the withdrawels. Whats wrong with me? Im thinking IM doomed for a life of feeling crappy and always being like this. Why me, why me, why me. Does anyone know how long it takes for the injection to start working and how long the injections last? I KNOW he told me I could do up to 12 shots per day but the script just says up to 8. Im so totally confused. Anyone with any insight sure would help some.
Thank you.
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lovepink
Goddess
Reged: 01/01/02
Posts: 1476
Loc: NYC Metro Area
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How long was the time period between when you last took any form of opiate & when you first injected yourself?
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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I took a hydro about 11:00 last night and did my shot around 10:00 am. Is that enough time?
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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Is the buprenorphine a combination preparation (with naloxone) or by itself? Is this for drug addiction? Are you injecting IM, SC or IV? How many milligrams does each injection contain? What was the total daily dose of hydro? (Info is really needed for better answers, not for any judgments!!!)
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
Edited by night_shade (04/23/04 09:57 AM)
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lovepink
Goddess
Reged: 01/01/02
Posts: 1476
Loc: NYC Metro Area
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A friend of mine just started buph (sublingual) to detox from hydro without W/D so I'm going by his experiences here...he let 12 hours elapse between the last dose of hydro & the first dose of buph so you should be okay. How many mg. per amp is your prescription for?
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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Im injecting IV and the AMP says 1ML. This is for drug addiction to Norco. I injected it into a pinched roll (lol) in my tummy as per the dr. Never felt a thing and I waited about 11 hours from last hydro dose until the injection. Ugh
Oh and the box says Buprenex Injectable (Buprenorphine Hydrochloride)
For intramuscular or intravaneous use
5 ampuls- 1 ml each
Above that it says 0.3 buprenorphine in 1 ml.
All of that confuses me. Please tell me anyone!
Edited by justforu (04/23/04 10:36 AM)
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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You can safely take up to 4-8mgs a day of the buprenorphine. There is no antagonist in this formulary of burprenorphine. I would take perhaps 2 or 3 amps per injection rather than more frequent injections.
Do online search for buprenorphine and do some reading about the treatment for opiate addiction. Do not resort to self-depracation when you "fail"--it will only make the guilt and shame worse and feed the addictive thinking. Just take it as a minor setback and move forward! If you need help or support, please feel free to PM..
Best of luck!
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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The nurse called back and said even if I did do more bup per injection it wouldnt matter because the bup has to push and empty all the hydro out of my receptors and that it will take a couple days to start feeling the effects of the bup. I thought that with the bup, you didnt get withdrawel. That sure isnt what I felt. Im very upset and very confused. Now starting tomarrow I will have to look forward to several days of withdrawel? That just doesn;t sound right to me. Talk about upset and depressing. I just want to crawl out from under a rock. I have 3 pills left for the rest of the day and am staring withdrawel in the face. How long do you have to wait until you start the injections? I know my dr told me but I am just drawing such a blank. I think I took some hydro before my appointment and now I realize how stupid that was because I cant remember everything.I also have some duragesic patches. Maybe If I use one it wont be so back with the withdrawels? I need some serious advice!
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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You are in withdrawal because you only waited 11 hours. This is NOTHING. 12 hours is the absolute minimum. I wish your doctor would have told you this.
My friend waited 15-16 hours.
Good luck.
-yawkaw
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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Your nurse is not an addiction medicine psychiatrist and should not act like one. What she just told you indicates absolutely no understanding at all of partial agonist/antagonist pharmacology.
Bupe DOES NOT CAUSE WITHDRAWL IF YOU DO IT CORRECTLY.
You cannot even take those pills because the bupe will block it, you cannot get high on full agonists (hydro, oxy, morphine, mmmm yummmy) while on bupe.
You are not supposed to wait several days for the bupe to push and empty all the hydro out of your receptors. You are supposed to wait an ABSOLUTE MINIMUM of 12 hours- 18 is more like it, but my friend got away with 15-16 because he is lucky like that.
This is not Temgesic. This is a serious drug. Do not take the advice of people who used 2-3 .2 mg Temgesic. Bupe is a very unique drug in regards to dosing. Less is SOMETIMES more, for you, it wouldn't be in the doses you previously took.
And why did he give you Buprenex? It sounds like his is not licensed to prescribe Suboxone/Subutex. Go to the http://buprenorphine.samhsa.gov website and look for the doctor locator and find one who IS licensed. This guy and staff are clueless, trust me on this one.
-yawkaw
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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I guess I never really answered your question.
If I understand you correctly, you only took 1.5 mg of bupe, right?
Did you hit a muscle? I know you didn't hit a vein. Did you just kinda stick it under the skin? All this depends because it affects how much bupe got into you. I need to know if you gave yourself an IV, IM, or SC injection.
With your dosage, you need to START with 8 mg of Bupe. You have to call and speak to the DOCTOR and ask why he did not want you to do this- you may have some other condition and that's why he wanted to start slow. I don't know.
Give us some more info, and I will help you.
Make sure you to ask why he wanted you on such a low dose and also ask what the intended method of ingestion was (IM, SC, IV).
-yawkaw
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myrrine
Member
Reged: 08/10/03
Posts: 163
Loc: Western PA
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When I come across a thread like this I am so grateful for Yawkaw and the other knowledgable people here. I've just started looking into bup programs. I'd like to get off of the hydro soon. I'm still in a lot of pain, but I really would like to have a baby within the next year to two years. I want my body to be as clean as possible. I refuse to have an opiate addicted baby.
Can anyone tell me how long they give bup for addiction? I'm afraid of replacing one drug for another, I really don't want to get caught up in the system so to speak. I'm really afraid of the pain, but I know I'll have to get used to advil again. Hopefully, this pregnancy will help my pain. I've heard so many stories of endometriosis sufferers who once they were pregnant had a long period of relief. I'm praying that God will smile on me in that regard. Anyway, I'm sorry I got off topic, but I'm very interested in seeing how things turn out.
Justforyou, please keep us posted on what is going on with you. I've seen Yawkaw help so many on this board, I'm sure he will be able to assist you.
Take Care All,
Myrrine
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They say "time marches on," I just never got used to the beat...
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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myrinne,
Congratulations on taking the first step towards a better life for you and your baby.
How long you stay on bupe depends on you and the doctor. A lot of doctors will want to put you on maintenance. You could stay on it 2-3 months if you want. I'd stay away from those 10-12 day detox programs, they're unrealistic IMO.
You can use bupe for pain- you could stay on it for a while and even have a baby on it.
I'll PM you about all this.
-yawkaw
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lovely11
Board Addict
Reged: 01/03/04
Posts: 338
Loc: With my dog at my side
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I agree 100% percent and then some that YawKaw has so much to offer here on the board. He always goes out of his way to help those in need. I appreciate him. I've told him before but I'll say it again - you will be rewarded for your pure heart.
To the original poster, my heart goes out to you. You'll be in my prayers. I know you'll get through this. We're definitely rooting for you here. I'd certainly be interested in how it turns out for you, as I'm sure many others would. As I've read and noticed lately, I'm not the only one doing a self-examination (and I don't mean breast ) and would appreciate the feedback on how successful or otherwise this program is for you.
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Lovely - devout dog lover
I wish I were half as good as my dog thinks I am.
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gottadoit
Enthusiast
Reged: 10/21/03
Posts: 269
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What you are going thru makes me so angry - it is completely unnecessary - your doctor should never have done this to you. I agree with YawKaw (as usual) that your doc can NOT be certified to prescribe the suboxone. If her were - he would not have given you the injectible - and he would have a clue what he is doing.
I only went 4 hours between my last dose of hydro and my first 2mg (NOT the 0.2 temgesic) and I felt COMPLETE relief from the wd symptoms that were just starting within 20 minuntes. I had no wd symptoms at all. My doc said that 4 hours is enough though others that I know had docs that required anywhere between 8 and 24 hours with no hydro before starting.
My doc only prescribed the 2mg tabs - he said the 8s are too strong and just are not necessary. He also only prescribes the sub for a 5 day detox period. He states that in his opinion anything longer is not medically necessary and that it is then just taking one drug instead of another. I did "hoard" a few of the pills so I was actually on them for about 7 days. He was right - there were NO wd symptoms at all. When I stopped it was just done - over - no issues.
I do not agree with suboxone maintenance. I know several people who went that route and had a terrible time getting off the sub.
Good luck to you - you can do this. If the injections do not bring you relief soon, go to the SAMSHA website and find a doc that can prescribe the suboxone for you. You'll never look back.
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nona
Stranger
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 9
Loc: Hawaii
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This is absolutely the best, most supportive & informative thread I have read on any board. You guys are magnificent!!!! I don't know how some of us would survive without you. A big Mahalo from Hawaii.
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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gottadoit,
We'll have to agree to disagree about maintenance. And 2 mg is not enough to throw you into withdrawal for most people, I was talking about people getting on buprenorphine induction with at least 8 mg who need to be 12 hours clean as a rule of thumb.
I just think that for people with certain sized habits for certain amounts of time, yes 5-12 days will get you clean off bupe w/o much physical withdrawal, but then what? Did you learn in the span of 5-12 days how to face the same challenges that made you an addict in the first place? Getting readjusted to sobriety is much more than conquering physical withdrawal- physical withdrawal can be dealt with and often is w/o bupe at all- it takes time to readjust to society and face life sober.
If a short detox was all that was neccessary to conquer addiction, we would have no addicts- people would simply cold turkey for a week and then be reborn.
I like the idea of maintenance because it lets you deal with your problems while not being high- bupe doesn't really feel like a high, it's just a general good mood without that normal feeling of a high.
Btw, when I refer to "you" and "I" I am doing so for conversation sake, I'm not implying anyone on here is an addict.
-yawkaw
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joanne2
Journeyman
Reged: 02/11/04
Posts: 71
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I hope your doing ok justoru, I will be praying for you.
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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Hi Everyone and thank you so much for all your replies. This weekend I went ahead and started back on the hydro. I coudn't take the withdrawels. This is what happened. Maybe it can give some insight to everyone and I can see what everyone thinks ok? I found a dr through the Bup locator. He said he couldn't help me (he just sent me home with duragesic patches!) but would have to send me to another dr. I went to the other dr and he gave me buprenex injections (1ml each) I inject with an isulin needle. I pinch a roll of fat in my stomach (front) and inject there. I am supposed to start out with 8 injections a day,the after 4 days go to 6 then after 4 days go to 4 then after 2 days go to 2 then go see him. I am supposed to wait 12 hours after my last dosage of hydro. Well I did that, took a shot and nothing. Waited did another and NOTHING. It just sent me into HORRIBLE WITHDRAWEL! I called the Drs office and the receptionist/nurse told me that i would just have to deal with it and even if I injected more it wouldnt matter. That there's a big fight going on in my receptors between the hydro and the bupe. So what I did, I just went back on the hydro so I could stop suffereing. The Bupe did nothing and if anything made the withdrawel worse. I waited and waiting and just felt worse. So now what? Im so confused. I know yall have said so much information it just really confuses me. I think my brain isnt functioning at 100%. Plus I think Im panicking! What if it doesnt work? Will I always be like this? Can a Dr be able to prescribe the Bup shots and not be certified to prescribe the Sub? Im not sure what to do, where to go. I did call all the DR's in my area from the Bup locator and NONE were taking anyone. This doctor is an hour and a half away! Oh Sheesh,, Sorry to rant and rave.
Me
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Trampy
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/02/02
Posts: 1241
Loc: Southwest U.S.
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Your doctor's prescription of Buprenex for drug detox is illegal under federal law. Please try to find a qualified addiction specialist or drug treatment center. Even a short-term methadone detox taper would probably be easier on you than what you're going through.
Trampy
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Your mileage may vary ...
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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I agree with Trampy 100%. The medication given to you for the purpose stated in the form it was prescribed is simply BAD NEWS.
Find a different doctor or perhaps (as a last resort) try a methadone program. They DO have 30 day detox (but PM me for more info as most will say they don't) and if you are dedicated, you can get off the hydro and the methadone in a few weeks with little withdrawal.
Get away from the doctor who ordered the under-powered buprenorphine for you. It's a drug that doesn't require so many injections in a day and should be given in much higher doses than you were prescribed.
Please seek a second medical opinion.
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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brenda1231
Journeyman
Reged: 11/22/03
Posts: 52
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Quote:
Hi Everyone and thank you so much for all your replies. This weekend I went ahead and started back on the hydro. I coudn't take the withdrawels. This is what happened. Maybe it can give some insight to everyone and I can see what everyone thinks ok? I found a dr through the Bup locator. He said he couldn't help me (he just sent me home with duragesic patches!) but would have to send me to another dr. I went to the other dr and he gave me buprenex injections (1ml each) I inject with an isulin needle. I pinch a roll of fat in my stomach (front) and inject there. I am supposed to start out with 8 injections a day,the after 4 days go to 6 then after 4 days go to 4 then after 2 days go to 2 then go see him. I am supposed to wait 12 hours after my last dosage of hydro. Well I did that, took a shot and nothing. Waited did another and NOTHING. It just sent me into HORRIBLE WITHDRAWEL! I called the Drs office and the receptionist/nurse told me that i would just have to deal with it and even if I injected more it wouldnt matter. That there's a big fight going on in my receptors between the hydro and the bupe. So what I did, I just went back on the hydro so I could stop suffereing. The Bupe did nothing and if anything made the withdrawel worse. I waited and waiting and just felt worse. So now what? Im so confused. I know yall have said so much information it just really confuses me. I think my brain isnt functioning at 100%. Plus I think Im panicking! What if it doesnt work? Will I always be like this? Can a Dr be able to prescribe the Bup shots and not be certified to prescribe the Sub? Im not sure what to do, where to go. I did call all the DR's in my area from the Bup locator and NONE were taking anyone. This doctor is an hour and a half away! Oh Sheesh,, Sorry to rant and rave.
Me
From my understanding of the buprenorphine treatment, you start with one drug, straight bup and then after a few days the bup with nalexone is added.
It sounds like maybe you were started immediately with the bup with nalexone maybe??
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Cheers,
B~
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gottadoit
Enthusiast
Reged: 10/21/03
Posts: 269
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Yawkaw,
The 5 day detox is for detox purpose ONLY. You are right that it does not help an addicted person "reprogram" (for lack of a better word). My doc was also very clear on this - the sub (as far as he was concerned) is for the medical/physical addiction only. He recommended outpatient counseling, NA, etc. for continued mental recovery. I understand that there are benefits for the long term use of the suboxone, and I would never tell anyone not to do that.
Regardless of how long a person takes this med, it IMO, truly is a wonder drug for the PHYSICAL wd symptoms. My usage was VERY high and the 2mgs managed it perfectly. Some people need the 8s and need them for a longer period of time. Every one is different. Good luck to everyone going thru this.
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Trampy
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/02/02
Posts: 1241
Loc: Southwest U.S.
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[quote...It sounds like maybe you were started immediately with the bup with nalexone maybe??
It was clearly stated to be Buprenex.
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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Oh Sheesh. Now what. Why do yall say it was illegal that this DR gave me the Bup shots? Im so confused! ugh. If he wasnt licensed to give it to me, then he couldnt give it to me right?, plus that is what his whole clinic does. It is nothing but for rehabing people, etc. Hes supposedly one of the first groups of doctors that got the license to give out the Bup. Hes been doing it like 22 years or something like that. So now my questions. Why is this illegal? What is the difference between him giving me Bup and the Sub besides the obvious of the types of meds(shots and the pills)? He never even mentioned the sub. He told me hes has nothing but success with this. Is it because its so low of a dose? If it didn't work then why would he be doing this? Im need to find out soon, im running out of hydro.
Quote:
I agree with Trampy 100%. The medication given to you for the purpose stated in the form it was prescribed is simply BAD NEWS.
Find a different doctor or perhaps (as a last resort) try a methadone program. They DO have 30 day detox (but PM me for more info as most will say they don't) and if you are dedicated, you can get off the hydro and the methadone in a few weeks with little withdrawal.
Get away from the doctor who ordered the under-powered buprenorphine for you. It's a drug that doesn't require so many injections in a day and should be given in much higher doses than you were prescribed.
Please seek a second medical opinion.
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yawkaw3
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 03/22/03
Posts: 1193
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Any doctor treating addiction who says he has "nothing but success" is lying. That would be like an oncologist saying he has saved the lives of every cancer patient who has ever walked into his office. It is the nature of the disease, not everyone gets better.
Anyway, I really think you need a new doctor.
If you weren't shooting anything to begin with, I cannot understand why the doctor would want to get you into that mindset. Just doesn't make sense to me.
About it being illegal- it is illegal in the United States to prescribe opioids to an opioid-addicted patient for the specific purpose of maintaining them (outside of a licensed treatment center) for more than a certain number of days (I believe 3 days, it may be a state-by-state thing, Trampy will possibly clarify this). Buprenex is an opiate indicated for pain, not detoxification, even though yes it has been used that way successfully for a long time. Suboxone/Subutex are different in that they are the first meds that are allowed to be prescribed outpatient to treat addiction that are opioids. So, prescribing Sub would be legal, but Buprenex wouldn't (even though he could legally prescribe it for pain, if that were the case- it's being used off-label here and because this is treating addiction, that's illegal). Keep in mind just because it's illegal, doesn't mean it isn't done every day, it is tolerated to some extent.
So that's the legalities.
I really have to urge you to discuss this with your doctor, while in the process lining up another one. Your doctor's inability to treat you led to relapse! That's horrible- he has failed you within days!
Do not lose faith in buprenorphine. It is an amazing drug, it really is. What you need is a doctor to prescribe Suboxone/Subutex. The first week you work on finding a stabilizing dose for you- just wait 12-15 hours before going from hydro to Sub and you will be ok. The first week isn't a picnic, but it's not withdrawal- it is comfortable with very, very minor withdrawal (like a sneezing fit or a loose bowel movement, tops). Once you find the dose that works for you (and try to keep it as low as possible, while still comfortable), let your new doctor know, and ask him where to go from there.
Keep trying doctors- I know going back to hydro is a lot more tempting than wading through the Best if kept off the board you seem to have to wade through to get Sub, but don't give up. You wanted to get off hydro for a reason, give it an honest shot. If after giving a Suboxone/Subutex an honest shot you say "this is stupid" that's one thing- just don't give up before you've even begun.
You have a choice of two roads here. One is fun at the very beginning, but leads to lots of pain down the road. The other isn't that bad up front, but it takes a little work on your part and the ending is much happier.
Best of luck to you, and please PM me if you want to talk about this more.
-yawkaw
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justforu
Newbie
Reged: 01/08/04
Posts: 44
Loc: San Antonio, TX
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Quote:
Any doctor treating addiction who says he has "nothing but success" is lying. That would be like an oncologist saying he has saved the lives of every cancer patient who has ever walked into his office. It is the nature of the disease, not everyone gets better.
Anyway, I really think you need a new doctor.
If you weren't shooting anything to begin with, I cannot understand why the doctor would want to get you into that mindset. Just doesn't make sense to me.
About it being illegal- it is illegal in the United States to prescribe opioids to an opioid-addicted patient for the specific purpose of maintaining them (outside of a licensed treatment center) for more than a certain number of days (I believe 3 days, it may be a state-by-state thing, Trampy will possibly clarify this). Buprenex is an opiate indicated for pain, not detoxification, even though yes it has been used that way successfully for a long time. Suboxone/Subutex are different in that they are the first meds that are allowed to be prescribed outpatient to treat addiction that are opioids. So, prescribing Sub would be legal, but Buprenex wouldn't (even though he could legally prescribe it for pain, if that were the case- it's being used off-label here and because this is treating addiction, that's illegal). Keep in mind just because it's illegal, doesn't mean it isn't done every day, it is tolerated to some extent.
So that's the legalities.
I really have to urge you to discuss this with your doctor, while in the process lining up another one. Your doctor's inability to treat you led to relapse! That's horrible- he has failed you within days!
Do not lose faith in buprenorphine. It is an amazing drug, it really is. What you need is a doctor to prescribe Suboxone/Subutex. The first week you work on finding a stabilizing dose for you- just wait 12-15 hours before going from hydro to Sub and you will be ok. The first week isn't a picnic, but it's not withdrawal- it is comfortable with very, very minor withdrawal (like a sneezing fit or a loose bowel movement, tops). Once you find the dose that works for you (and try to keep it as low as possible, while still comfortable), let your new doctor know, and ask him where to go from there.
Keep trying doctors- I know going back to hydro is a lot more tempting than wading through the Best if kept off the board you seem to have to wade through to get Sub, but don't give up. You wanted to get off hydro for a reason, give it an honest shot. If after giving a Suboxone/Subutex an honest shot you say "this is stupid" that's one thing- just don't give up before you've even begun.
You have a choice of two roads here. One is fun at the very beginning, but leads to lots of pain down the road. The other isn't that bad up front, but it takes a little work on your part and the ending is much happier.
Best of luck to you, and please PM me if you want to talk about this more.
-yawkaw
So basically he gave me the Bup for pain? Not addiction? So any doctor can prescribe shots of Bup? Im sorry for seeming dense but Im trying here guys. Is there anything I can do since I do allready have it? I really really have called the Sub doctors on my list. I DO NOT know where to go guys. This is something I HAVE TO DO for myself. Can I do the shots I allready have? Oh why oh why? Why have I done this to myself? It seemed as though when I did the Bup the other day my withdrawels were MUCH MUCH worse than normal. Why is that?
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Trampy
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/02/02
Posts: 1241
Loc: Southwest U.S.
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Quote:
Oh Sheesh. Now what. Why do yall say it was illegal that this DR gave me the Bup shots? Im so confused! ugh. If he wasnt licensed to give it to me, then he couldnt give it to me right?, plus that is what his whole clinic does. It is nothing but for rehabing people, etc. Hes supposedly one of the first groups of doctors that got the license to give out the Bup. Hes been doing it like 22 years or something like that. So now my questions. Why is this illegal? What is the difference between him giving me Bup and the Sub besides the obvious of the types of meds(shots and the pills)? He never even mentioned the sub.
If he's licensed to give you Subutex, then you could ask him for that instead, that is, if you still want to use buprenorphine after your experience with it. I also totally agree with yawkaw3 that it's very odd (and bordering on malpractice) to turn someone needing drug addiction treatment into an injecting opioid drug user ... when a better and stronger oral form of the same drug is available. God help you! Most people are afraid of needles, but he forced you to self-inject an opioid that is at least somewhat euphoric for most people. This doctor breaks the law and he has also failed to deliver the standard of care. If you become addicted to injecting opioids because of his violation of the law and medical standards, you might win a malpractice lawsuit.
Yes, it's true: any DEA-licensed doctor can prescribe Buprenex for pain. Some brave doctors even prescribe it off-label for depression. Both are legal. But it's illegal to use it for drug detox outside of the federal regulations. Maybe this addiction doctor already has 30 patients on Subutex/oxone and he's evading that limit by giving you Buprenex instead of Subutex; and that would be illegal. It's also possible that because of the strong antagonist reaction you got from the Buprenex, maybe buprenorphine is just not for you; if so, you'd be better off with a methadone taper.
Injecting three 0.3-mg ampoules is the rough equivalent of a 2-mg Subutex tab because the bioavailability of the sublingual is around 50%. Buprenorphine works fine for most people, but maybe not for you.
If your addiction clinic doctor is board certified in addiction and has a Bupe license, he could probably use methadone with you instead, but it depends on your state's laws and the terms of his clinic's license. If i were in your shoes, i'd go for a methadone detox, because of your bad reaction to the Buprenex. Methadone takes more self-discipline, but if you stick to a slow taper it can be relatively painless.
My advice is to find another doctor who is board certified in addiction treatment and is authorized to use methadone for detox because if Subutex doesn't work, that's what they'll need to use. The doctor you found is bad news. Don't let him cause you more harm.
Trampy
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Your mileage may vary ...
Edited by Trampy (04/26/04 09:58 PM)
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Yeppers
Newbie
Reged: 04/17/04
Posts: 46
Loc: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Well, Hi everybody.
I have been a lurker for about 10 mos.
Thanks to all for such wonderful input, just reading has helped me tremendously.
Unfortunately, I never read enough on the warnings about tolerance/dependance until after the fact. Of course, like most addicts, I started down this road innocently enough, treating my pain, and at first , the hydro also greatly improved my depression.
Fast forward 8 mos.
I now have an appt. early May for a consult to try and get on bupe. I have tried and failed with the temgesic 2X's. Both times I felt W/d, the second worse than the first.
Reading this thread, I am worried that the bupe just isn't for me.
I tapered last week (M-F), down to an amount that is still quite high, but about 2/3 of what I ws taking.
When I reached for the hydro this morning, the emptiness of the bottle scared me and made me face how many I took over the weekend. I won;t even go there...it's scary.
So instead of the hydro, this am I took 3, .2mg temgesic. Waited an hour. Not much relief from w/d so I took 30mg of hydro, despite reading that the hydro 'couldn't get in'. I have not gotten 'high' on hydro for a long, long time. Just been taking it to avoid w/d. Now I feel depressed and lethargic, but no full blown w/d, and don't know whether it the tems worked or the hydro? What should I do now? Keep taking the hydro, or take the temgesic. (I only have about 30 of them).
I called the 2 doctors in my area from the Buprenorphine physician locator.
Got appt with one for the beginning of May, and the other was a voice mail and hasn't called back. I have no insurance, and don't know how long it will take to get into the program or even if I will be able to get in, or how much it will cost. The first appt. is $156 just to find out if I qualify! Of course, I know that in the long run, the hydros are costlier, physically and financially.
So now I am just scared. And nobody knows or even suspects about my drug use/abuse.
Any advice or input id appreciated.
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lovely11
Board Addict
Reged: 01/03/04
Posts: 338
Loc: With my dog at my side
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YEPPERS:
The first thing I want to say to you is "you are NOT alone! Don't drown yourself in guilt, it will not get you anywhere except in a deeper pit of depression. Just typing those words you just typed allowed you to lessen the power of the hydro. Secrets are only secrets if you don't tell. By your telling your secret, it's grip has become a little less tight around your neck. It's kind of like turning the light on and see the roaches scramble.
I don't have the answers for you, my friend. I'm in your same boat. Every day I come here to try and find the right words someone has written that will motivate me to walk down that very scary road of living life without these Best if kept off the board pills. As the tears stream down my cheek this very moment thinking of this predicament I find myself in and thinking of all the other people affected by addiction, I'm still looking today. I know one thing.....I won't give up. When I give up, I lose and I don't want to lose so I'll keep on trying.
My thoughts are with you. Feel free to PM any time for any reason, if for nothing else but knowing someone can relate to what you're going through.
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Lovely - devout dog lover
I wish I were half as good as my dog thinks I am.
Edited by lovely11 (04/26/04 01:03 PM)
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