mermaid72000
Member
Reged: 01/19/04
Posts: 125
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i went off hydro no holiday just tapered becuz it just got out of hand seemed to have to take more just to feel anything. i know people take these holidays to keep their tolerance in check but going thru wd and cold turkey and going going back on the hydro seems a painful way to live. going thru wd all the time to keep their tolerance is hard for me to understand, once your body is clean from opiates and to turn around around and start over seems like torture. going thru hydro wd is such a painful physical and emotional experience. i know there alot of people who can explain why this proces is necessary. i have pain everyday but the wd process is something very fresh in my mind.
thanks in advance for any advice
carol
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oldnavy170
Board Addict
Reged: 05/12/03
Posts: 357
Loc: New York
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I find taking a Holiday is important to lowering the amount of Hydro you need to work on pain. If you do not take these Holidays then you just keep increasing the amount of Hydro and even increasing the amount doesn't always work for your pain.
I myself have gone cold turkey more times than I can tell you but after a week I feel pretty good again. Also when I start taking Hydro again I take it in less amounts.
If you must take a Holiday then I suggest reading the board on ways to ease the withdrawls.
Good Luck!!!!!!
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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I'm glad somebody finally asked this question. I understand that development of tolerance can be a difficult consequence of the use of opioids on a moderate to long-term basis...HOWEVER, a few days off from a particular medication does NOT lower your tolerance for more than a day or two. And even years of abstinence does not return your tolerance to zero.
I simply do not understand why anyone would put themselves through withdrawal for the gain of a day or two of more effectiveness. Unless of course, the brain is effectively tricked into believing there is less tolerance and so therefore it FEELS like the drugs works better after a holiday?
The only "holidays" I have taken have been out of necessity (couldn't afford my prescription for a few days) and while it sure seemed like the medication worked much better that first day, perhaps even 2, it just went right back up to normal right away.
Here are a few interesting references and articles detailing opioid tolerance development and retardation or reversal.
Reducing Tolerance To Morphine Could Aid Pain Therapy
Analgesic Tolerance to Opioids
The involvement of a specific serotonin receptor in opioid withdrawal
Tolerance, physical dependence and addiction: Definitions, clinical relevance and misconceptions
Morphine Effectiveness Restored To Between 80 And 90% Of Original Amount
Tolerance, Addiction and Effective Pain Management
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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tone
Veteran
Reged: 06/29/03
Posts: 558
Loc: Chicago
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5-HT.3 agonists huh? maybe thats how ibogaine helps some people
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PlyrLacy
Enthusiast
Reged: 12/29/01
Posts: 242
Loc: Mid-Atlantic, USA
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Since the question is "why are there hydro holidays" I can honestly add that there are a variety of reasons.
I had a problem with Ken's Drugs and they forgot to send my refill when scheduled, then New Year's came and the first shipping date was on Jan 2nd. I received the 3rd. By the time all of this was straightened out I was without meds for 9 days. I would call this a forced holiday, but holiday none the less.
There was a doc here online, cannot remember his name, who forced holidays on patients when he thought it was time. About every few months. If you called in for your normal consult he would inform you when HE thought you should take a month off and he would not write the script.
There are holidays, like previously mentioned, when you simply do not have the funds to purchase the consult and resulting script. I hate it when that happens.
There are holidays, self prescribed, when the individual just does not want to continue on the current medication path. Holidays to adjust tolerance, which seem useful to some and not to others. Holidays when you run out of medication, someone steals it, it does not make the month, or is destroyed in a fire.
In all reality, there are probably as many reasons for hydro holidays as there are people. It's a personal decision, sometimes chosen and sometimes chosen for us.
In any case the remedies for holidays can be very useful and I am so thankful that we have members here for support and advice to get us through these holidays as comfortably as possible. You are all angels. 
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"Lacy"
Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt and dance like no one is watching.
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xiolablue15
Journeyman
Reged: 03/17/04
Posts: 59
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I think that some people take holidays because they feel guilty about their dependence on the opiates, but they are too afraid to completely come off of it. I mean, if the drug is no longer working as well or you need to take like a handful to feel anything then perhaps it's time to move on. Explore other means of relief. And when i say that people are afraid to come off completely I don't necessarily mean that they are afraid of their chronic pain, I mean they are scared to not have that cushion to fall back on. Let's face it, when you know that you have a pill that will keep you feeling good, and i mean GOOD, not just normal, that is a GREAT feeling. Like a security blanket. When I was little I wouldn't give up that security blanket for NOTHING.
And the word "holiday"...it sounds so nice...so pleasant...
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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Amen to that xiolablue15...
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 466
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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The reason and outcome of a "holiday", I believe, depends on the person taking the holiday. For myself, I went cold turkey because I'd noticed how quickly I began needing twice the amount of hydro. to feel the same effect. And rather than needing it maybe 10-15 days a month, suddenly, I found I needed it every day. As soon as I realized what was happening, fortunately, I decided this was not what I wanted for my life- so I took a holiday/cold turkey and got it out of my system. Now, for me, in part, I wanted to drop the tolerance level- but I also wanted to get over the "need" to take the pills every day. I am now back to having a lower tolerance and the need for pills is back to being weekends only (as mentioned in a different post, I won't take them during the week unless I feel like I'm dying because I won't sleep- that's one of the side effects for me)- or on a PRN basis. Different strokes for different folks, but that's my story and I'm stickin' to it 
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
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night_shade
Threadhead
Reged: 08/26/03
Posts: 907
Loc: The State of Hockey
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Greycie
My anesthesiologist told me there are really only 2 ways of effectively reducing tolerance...abstinence for a LONG period of time (several months to several years) or a substantial reduction in dose for a long period of time.
If holidays help people get their doses down and stay down, then I think they are worth the self-torture withdrawal induces and is well worth the effort.
I was previously referring to the holidays which end after a few days and the people go right back to their usual dose. It doesn't seem to me there is much point in going through the pain of withdrawal in such a scenario. But to each their own, especially if it works for them. I personally would never do this to myself for such a small benefit.
Have a great day!
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Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
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Greycie
Old Hand
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 466
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
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Hey nightshade- I understand what you're getting at and as I said, each person has their own reasons. You'd also have to keep in mind, my tolerance was growing quickly and therefore, I hadn't been taking the pills every day but for a few months when I decided I wasn't going to do that with my life- I'm too young to spend every day on pain killers. I didn't have extended use over a period of many, many years and the amount of pills I was taking was up to 2 1/2 Lorcet (25 mg of hydro. per dose). While some people may guffaw at that, my withdrawal was every bit as real and intollerable as the next persons- but it also made it easier for me to need less of the same medication and less frequently. As for what you were specifically asking, I can't answer that as that was never my action or intent.
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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
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